Blizzard I love you.

I love you so unreservedly that it is painful for me to have to write this.

I have been playing Diablo 2 with a group of friends of mine since before it came out, basically.

I am still playing it, on and off, now. Thanks for keeping battle net going, Diablo 2 is simply the best game on the market, uncontestedly, as far as we are concerned.

Let's talk about Diablo 3 for a second though, can we?

I'm writing this because in between wondering if Zac Efron's having said Ian Mckellan was his favorite actor in Rolling Stone meant that he was gay and thinking about how one would go about explaining Ludwig Wittgenstein to the Dalai Llama (the secret to which is in Frank Herberts Dune and Bruce Lee's JKD, if you were curious about that last one, the first one I don't myself know about - ) I started thinking about something my friend Paul said.

My friend Paul is really good at a few things, I should explain. The thing that's germane (and on display in this particular comment) is in divining what the most competatively advantageous class to be is in any given system.

The remark was: "Paladins shouldnt exist as one class in Diablo 3."

This is so true that it deserves public forum, which is part of why I'm here. What I was thinking about alongside this comment is the other part, and it's to do with what I almost chose as the title for the forum post - Franchise Management, a depressing exception to the similiarities in the Blizzard and WoTC corporate structures.




What in the name of all that is right and good in the world are you doing with the classes in this game?

I Don't Understand You. I -DON'T- Understand.

Obscenities are required for me to be more expressive, but I think that's a true enough level to proceed in explaining what so upsets me.

You have to look at it like this.

In a game like Diablo, classes are like individual cards in Magic the Gathering.

Ok, I have to explain a little bit further here because although it seems like you guys are in related fields I don't know how much you communicate with eachother or are familiar with eachother's work.

So in Magic the Gathering, or in what I have read of it, there is a concept called 'Design Space' which refers to a kind of conceptual terrain for the designers of new additions to the game (of which there are many, designers for and additions to, magic is a very dynamic game). This terrain is in some senses of the word a resource, and the development of it, of new arenas within it, and of sustainable ways to maintain it, is the business of the R&D department (with interface to the management..etc. I am constructing the shell of the thing you understand.

Interestingly, although only a little relatedly, there was a mechanic that was humorously highlighted as being overbroad in this same way as the paladin, the split card mechanic. Hahaha, anyway.

Paladins. They are overbroad in design space.

This is just kind of true, they gave them the ability to be a credible melee class fairly easily, Hammerdins are god's own terror and have a unique element that nothing resists, and they can get into elemental @!#! if they need to.

Paladins.

Hahah, but here's the messed up bit.

I don't think you guys get that, but I -also- don't think that Diablo 3 is going to have enough classes for it even to really -matter- , which is what I just DONT understand.


YOUR JOB IS TO MAKE MAGIC CARDS AND YOU DONT MAKE LOTS OF THEM.


Now hold up, slow up, stop, control.

I'm not crazy. I get that balancing classes is probably really, really difficult.

I get that manz.

That's really not what I'm talking about, although hey that would be cool. You guys should probably de-mystify that for us in the consumer base by the way, it would be nice to know what it was that wasnt making the cut, having some kind of voter system for what ideas that get cut get developed into the downloadable content later.

That is so obviously the paradigm replacement for MMOs by the way is just a system of codifying expectation with respect to seasonal expansion packs. Ala City of Heroes but better.

Whatever.

What I'm -really- talking about is the Archivist.

Your joke department.

Yeah.

Ha.


See the joke is, I take it, that you wasted time designing that instead of an actual new class.

My point blizzard is that if you want to have only 5 classes you -can't- have them be the Amazon and the Paladin.

I'm sorry brothers, there's nothing I can do about that.

That just isn't a good game, and it is doomed to failure.

The three classes you have released to us so far have been the Barbarian, who is from Diablo 2, where he was the spiritual heir to the Warrior of Diablo 1.

Fail.

The Wizard, a renamed Sorceress who was a femal Sorcerer. Diablo 1.

Fail.

The Witchdoctor, who is the Necromancer and I guess some scraps of the druid it looked like. Hahaha.

Fail.

You are out of options dudes.

I mean, you -HAVE- to advance your franchise, or it will die. Austin Powers is the proof of this, right? Like all bad franchises, just feeding on its own gut.

You can't -just- have the old stuff back with the new shiny skin. It doesnt work, and even when it works ok you have just made essentially Titan Quest 2 instead of DIABLO 3, do you understand?


But it's ok. There is still time. You are blizzard, we weren't expecting this game until forever anyway. You can go back. You can mine for new veins of actual potential that still fits with Diablo 2.

Also, hey.

Remember? That game was awesome. You can do more direct incorporation maybe than you think?

You should have seen our Anti Paladin man. You know like on the Forge.net, where everybody has their fantasy heartbreak game? I feel like every real player of Diablo has their heartbreak folder of things they hope you are going to do.

You get to do it man! I would be writing out classes every damn day if I were in your position. We all would. Because you get to make the next one of a really really successful game franchise.

I like the idea of the rage bar, that's cool.

Our Anti Paladin had a similiar thing, we designed a passive summon mechanic? So the idea was that when the Worldstone barrier got weaker the people of the church of Zakarum either went with the vestiges of the councils black heresiarchy or were incorporated more fully into the angelic ranks, so the class splits into Cleric (active healer, ala the necro's curses, with some passive nods to making it give back a little mana..etc.) and Anti Paladin, who gets the paladin's offensive aura tree and then this passive one with the summon branch.

So the idea was that you filled a sacrifice gauge with personal kills, and then once it was full every successive kill had a percentage chance to trigger whichever of the summons you had designated (or possibly just whichever one you had the most points in, that would work). So they have either hitpoints or a timer, I liked hitpoints he liked timer, and then cooldown to the bar.

Isn't that awesome? So you'd get a sometimes valkyrie.

We were thinking a blaster one, like the lich in Titan Quest, and then a Melee One that would get a taunt or something with higher levels in it, and then (maybe) a shadow-paladin, like the assassin's pet, but see the trick would be that this one has your skills, including the passive summon, so the shadow could (small chance) recurse itself, and you could have like three.

So awesome! The occasional one man front line.

I dont know, I like it a lot, we had a couple others. EVERYONE has a couple of these.

YOU should have a couple of these, and they should be a hell of lot better researched and worded.

You are PAID to do this.

Please.

I want to enjoy your games. I was begging for you to just palette shift some monsters, shuffle some boards and scramble the skill trees and charge me 20 dollars.

We all were, but now it's a whole new game, and it's time to be honest about it.

We're all -probably- going to play your game, but that doesn't mean it will be something you should be proud of, nor that it won't be the ultimate death of the franchise itself.

And you can make me not play it, and that's if you show me loudly enough that you don't care about it any more.

Enough jokes manz. I like your story a lot. You should too.

What the hell man... get to the point. I read the first few lines then I scrolled down and saw what I was in for.

Andoprime, where have you been?

Look in the Diablo III FAQ. You will see there IN PLAIN SIGHT that "the Barbarian is the ONLY class from Diablo II being brought over". That means your argument against Paladins in Diablo III is moot.

Besides, not all Paladins have Blessed Hammer. I'm pretty sure that if Blizzard wanted to bring over the Paladin, they would give him entirely new skills and not just a direct copy-over from Diablo II. I know we all think Blizzard is lazy, but come on, they're not THAT lazy.

The only classes they've officially announced are the Barbarian, Witch Doctor, and the Wizard. That makes up the Tank, the Summoner, and the Elemental Spellcaster. What they need now is a ranged character (Archer) and either a melee/range hybrid (Ninja!) or a support class (Priest).

That just gave me a headache. 0.0

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Q u o t e:


Ninja-ranger-priest.

Stealthily shoots arrows covered in holy water?

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That would be awesome.

And looking at your sig, I think a better April Fools joke would've been the Chuck Norris class, showcasing the 3 skills of Roundhouse, Stare, and Awesome Radiation.

So.


1) Too long.

Hahahaha, ok? I had a lot to say? Or whatever?


2) Could have just said classes were not unique enough.

Yes. But that would not have explained my standards for uniqueness and therefore would have been critique without construction.


3) Argument for Paladin's not existing is irrevelevant because they said only Barb is getting ported from d2.

Ok so that's a lie, right? The wizard is the sorcerer and the Witch Doctor the Necro, so clearly they have -only- imported classes so far, by my criterion.


4) gave you a headache.

Sorry manz.

So to elaborately respond to that other thing that got said about support classes .


- I don't think the game should assign role unchangeably to class? But you might be right, that seems to be the trend, in which case I would think that a dedicated support class would be cool but not probable - plus Witch Doctor would function that way as Necro did, and d2 wasnt set up for person to person healing, although they might change that. Curses man! That's the model.


Archers. Yeah. I mean, sure. Although that would be the zon unless they did something wicked amazing with it.

I don't really care about what classes they put in, I trust Blizzard to make goods ones once they look in the right areas, I'm talking about where they look et al.


I mean, yaknow.

HAHAHA wait was that seriously the forum guy?

Oh man. Bashiok.


That.. that was not. what I was saying.


Hahahaha.

Or, I mean yeah, but like. Seriously? That's the post you wanted?


DEAR BLIZZARD: CLASSES NOT UNIQUE ENOUGH, K THX.


hahahaha, that would have been terrible. Like. What?

I seriously thought that was just some guy.

Come on man, it's Monday and we are both tracking a Diablo 3 thread, let's not be worried about how we write, ok?


So.



How is the Sorceress the Wizard?


A blaster!

How is the Witch Doctor the Necro?

Wait. what?

Summons. Curses. TERROR?

lets just roll with it man, what else did you say?


Sorc = Fire / Lightning / Cold
Wizard = Conjuring / Arcane / Cold / Lightning / Melee / Time abilities etc etc...

Is there conjuring? That's pretty kickass I didn't remember that.

And yeah, pretty much. There isnt a lot of room for more that one blaster without getting really creative, what dissapoints me is that they are not getting creating. See Bashiok being mad at me or whatever.

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Q u o t e:
WD = Pets are a distraction, not the main source of damage

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-- [[ see Druid ]]

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Q u o t e:
Necro = Pets are main source of damage(variant on spec)

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-- yeah I hated summoners anyway, but you get the picture? Like, clearly he is the -heir- to the necro, I didnt mean identical I mean design spacey

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Q u o t e:
Just because they're similar doesn't mean they're a copy, you dolt.

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-- haha, nah man I know

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Q u o t e:
The original RPG was what, a fighter mage and archer or something? Every single RPG class is a spin off of those three archtypes.

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-- Right and designing variations is what the thing is about right?

I dont get why you are mad at me except that I type a lot and happen to be posting today.

Evolutionary, Revolutionary. Both systems work.

I personally (see how I only include myself here) like the way they're going.

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Q u o t e:






So.


1) Too long.

Hahahaha, ok? I had a lot to say? Or whatever?


2) Could have just said classes were not unique enough.

Yes. But that would not have explained my standards for uniqueness and therefore would have been critique without construction.


3) Argument for Paladin's not existing is irrevelevant because they said only Barb is getting ported from d2.

Ok so that's a lie, right? The wizard is the sorcerer and the Witch Doctor the Necro, so clearly they have -only- imported classes so far, by my criterion.


4) gave you a headache.

Sorry manz.

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The Wizard is only vaguely similar to the Sorceress, mostly in general concept. In the same sense that the Sorceress was "vaguely" a Sorcerer from Diablo in that she wielded the elements, was a glass cannon, and used magic to blast things from afar, the Wizard in Diablo III resembles the Sorceress from Diablo II in only those concepts. Watching the gameplay videos, the class seems incredibly unique and much, much different than a Sorceress. If you're so closed minded to label something in this way, it's your problem. There's nothing any of us can do to change your mind, and all Blizzard could do is take away the "glass cannon caster" concept completely, which would honestly outrage a large portion of the community.

The same comments generally go for the WItch Doctor, except that I see even less of a connection. There's an EXTREMELY thin connection to the Necromancer, but I really have to try to make it fit into that niche. I think the class is perfect. It brings original elements, a unique concept, and interesting new gameplay mechanics while still retaining the style of power we're used to seeing in Diablo (fire, undead, minions, disease, etc.). If you're going to typecast any class that has a minion or utilizes undead or "poison" as a Necromancer or Druid, then there's not much Blizzard can do for you.

The classes are fine. You'll likely be disappointed when they announce the rest of the classes, as I'd expect them to have "something" similar to the old classes. One will probably specialize in ranged physical attacks, and another might focus on buffs of some sort. Deal with it.